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2nd Person in Poetry, Poetry Critique Guidelines, Robert Herrick, Victoria C. Slotto, Walt Whitman
Last Saturday for Poetics, Fred Rutherford invited us to write first person narrative poetry, so today I’d like follow suit and explore the second person.
As you know, second person point of view uses the pronoun “you” and its variants to address the protagonist, the reader or a specific person or object.
Point of view is an important consideration for writers of prose. In my experience, first person point of view allows intimate insight into the mind and emotion of the protagonist but limits the same for secondary and minor characters. It also confines the writer to a specific time and place.
Third person, on the other hand, presents the story from the writer’s point of view, allowing her or him to comment on the story and giving omniscience into all the players. A downside is that it restrains the reader from a deeper emotional connection with the protagonist whose reactions always seem just a bit beyond our reach.
As for second person point of view in fiction, there are authors such as William Faulkner who may include short sections or chapters in the second person, but I can’t remember reading an entire novel in this voice, although I suspect it has been done. A few years back, an MFA student in my writing critique group wrote quite effective short stories in the second person. Her stories gave me the impression, as expected, that she was speaking directly to me and, at times, instructing me.
It isn’t rare to encounter poetry in the second person. As poets, we love to address our audience, celebrity figures, other poets or teachers who have an influence on us, people we love (or hate), God, mythological figures, people from our past or lovers for whom we are still waiting. It can even be an object or an aspect of nature.
Consider this poem by the well-known 17th Century poet, Robert Herrick:
Gather Ye Rosebuds while Ye May
By Robert Herrick
(1591 – 1674)
.
Gather ye rosebuds while ye may,
Old Time is still a-flying:
And this same flower that smiles today
To-morrow will be dying.
.
The glorious lamp of Heaven, the sun,
The higher he’s a-getting,
The sooner will his race be run.
And nearer he’s to setting.
.
That age is best which is the first,
When youth and blood are warmer;
But being spent, the worse, and worst
Times still succeed the former.
.
Then be not coy, but use your time,
And while ye may, go marry:
For having lost but once your prime,
You may for ever tarry.
(This poem is part of the Public Domain)
The poem is written in the imperative form, instructive to the reader or listener. I read it recently under the title “To Young Virgins,” which gives a sense of his intended audience, though his underlying message applies to everyone, reminding us that time passes quickly.
Another example, this one by Walt Whitman, addresses the city of Manhattan:
City of Orgies
City of orgies, walks and joys,
City whom that I have lived and sung in your midst will one day make
Not the pageants of you, not your shifting tableaus, your
spectacles, repay me,
Not the interminable rows of your houses, nor the ships at the wharves,
Nor the processions in the streets, nor the bright windows with
goods in them,
Nor to converse with learn’d persons, or bear my share in the soiree
or feast;
Not those, but as I pass O Manhattan, your frequent and swift flash
of eyes offering me love,
Offering response to my own–these repay me,
Lovers, continual lovers, only repay me.
(Walt Whitman, Public Domain)
For today’s prompt, I invite you to write a poem in the second person. Many of you do this routinely, so I challenge (not confine you) you to a more specific prompt.
Consider addressing:
• Your favorite poet, one who has influenced your own writing;
• A celebrity you would invite to dinner if you had a choice;
• An inanimate object;
• An entity such as time, a holiday, an event from history;
• Rewriting one of your own poems from 1st or 3rd person into second.
To participate:
• Write your poem and post it on your blog or website;
• Access Mr. Linky at the bottom of this post and add your name and the direct URL to your submission;
• Spend time enjoying and commenting on the work of your fellow pubsters, especially those who have taken the time to do so for you.
• Enjoy your time writing and reading poetry.
When we first began dVerse, Meeting the Bar was intended as an opportunity for peer critique. That aspect has slipped into oblivion—for myself, perhaps because I’m not comfortable with my skills, having had only a one-semester class in poetry in undergraduate school. I suggest you revisit Critique Guidelines as presented by the talented (and well-educated) Luke Prater (you will need to scroll to the end of the post which initially deals with redundant phrasing.) Many of us used to be a part of his on-line critique group and miss this opportunity. For those who would like to receive a critique of your post, just ask for it it in your post, then those of you who are comfortable, jump in and offer your suggestions.
For dVerse Meeting the Bar, this is Victoria C. Slotto inviting you to check out my novel, Winter is Past, at http://victoriacslotto.com/ Happy Holidays to all of you.
this is a cool prompt victoria…and i really had fun with it…wrote first person and included 2n person snippets, addressing the reader… looking forward to what everyone comes up with…smiles
Loved the sejour in Paris, Claudia. (Wish I had accents on my computer!)
smiles…i can borrow you one if you like… séjour…smiles…
Merci, ma belle amie!
There are a whole load of shortcuts to accents and special characters which I researched and then printed out the list of the most useful, which is sellotaped to the panel of my laptop. Numlock must be ON Eg à = alt +133 é = alt +130
If you would be interested, I will dig out the (ancient) file from the pc upstairs and send it to you.
That would be fun. When I work in Word, my computer allows me to create my own accent shortcuts or insert symbols…but in comments. Not sure. Nope…I just tried one. Didn’t work. Only go digging if you have time, Viv.
great article victoria…and great challenge…it was not easy for me…i know i do little bits of 2nd person at times but i am much more comfrotable with 3rd and 1st person…..had fun with it though…
Not easy, perhaps…but so well done.
You did great with it, Brian.
yep i think yours was not that bad bri…haha…just teasing you a bit…smiles
Wonderful article, Victoria–I kind of got tangled up in the second & third persons together, and imperative and interrogative senses in a really dark way–this prompt took me somewhere rather dark, but I like the results!
Hee…I like dark poetry (and prose). Look forward to reading it, Susan.
Just loved yours!
dang susan, yours gave me shivers.. powerfully penned
Thank you, Claudia. Like I just said to Mary in my comments, it just came out that way, that fast. Still surprised by it.
dont you love it when that happens?
Yes, I do 😉
Instant poetry that surprises…
Welcome, poets. My husband tells me I mix up a mean Manhattan, so belly up to the bar, bring a poem, enjoy each other’s work and company. Ask for critique if you wish! I have an appointment in a while but will be back to read and comment soon. Bonne Sante!
ha – i think i should try that mean manhattan you mix then…smiles
Well, maybe you need to come back and meet me in the desert! Make up for last time. :0)
I took your advice, and rewrote one of my poems, focusing on the second person narrative. Often we free spirit poets jump from 3rd person to 1st, through 2nd and back to third, keeping the POV fresh; a fun prompt; thanks.
Nice blend, Glenn.
you know, if a sax appears in a poem, you won me already over..smiles
I love how those things we do every day are brought to light and named through the wonderful articles presented here. Critique may have fallen by the wayside (I’m always open to receive…but feel I am no one to offer) but you can’t doubt the amount we learn with every meet…much thanks to YOU, Victoria…always a wealth of knowledge to be found 🙂
Thanks, Tash. Like you, I don’t feel adequate to critique. Just wanted to allow people the opportunity. I miss FEPC!
Thanks for the prompt Victoria. 2nd person is the natural voice for a teacher – so that’s how I approached this.
Rockin’!
ha…you made it sound so easy….
Victoria, what an interesting article and prompt. I will periodically write in 2nd person. I think it draws the reader into the poem, though at times may be a bit disconcerting.
Victoria, I have a question about the poem you shared. I was just thinking that I would probably call this a third person poem because the majority of the poem Is in third person. The “you’s” are mostly in some kind of ‘conversation,’ which can be included in third person poems. And the ‘you’ is not addressing the reader at all, but one of the characters in the poem. Could you explain to me why this would be a 2nd person poem? (I may be gone for a while…so I may not see your answer for a while…but I will be back.)
I can see what you mean. For me it was 2nd person because, even though I’d never read it to her, I wrote it “to” a person I love who is suffering from mild dementia. It was written as an address to her.
Yikes, Victoria, I was looking at the wrong poem. I was looking at the poem before the one you shared today. Yes, this one is definitely 2nd person. So sorry about my comment.
Nothing to be sorry about. I thought because it spoke so much about her past that you saw it as 3rd person. This is to my mother to be exact. But she is not as far advanced as I make it sound, so it’s a bit fictional.
wonderful prompt. I reposted a re-worked older poem. I don’t want to miss out on the fun today and can’t wait to read everyone’s work. yours was incredible, Victoria. thank you.
Thank you, Jane. I look forward to reading yours…heading off to an appointment now.
loved the handblown jellyfish…
agree the imagery of that opening stanza is very cool…
I enjoy writing second person poems. Thanks for this wonderful article, Victoria and opportunity to share.
i need to try it more often…ha…
And clearly, you’re skilled at them, Laurie.
my last post until i get back to america!
perfect prompt victoria for some amazing chance shots i got of my wife and claudia in paris in an old church (though you can’t tell it’s them 😉 )
will try to catch up with comments, visit pages etc as able through tomorrow
take care everyone, best wishes 😉
ha…smiles..on my way over…
hope you like it young lady 😉
oh smiles…so enjoyed your Passages in Moments…
travel light sir….have enjoyed soaking in your paris trip while you were there…
Can’t wait. Safe trip home, Felipe.
I hope mine meets the bar…Great prompt Victoria. Very interesting read.
hey bren…hope you are having a good day…stopped by your place earlier cause i had not seen you…smiles.
Definitely meets the bar!
I linked to my first poem ever to dVerse, have seen so many of the blogs I follow to present it here. I will try to read as many as I can, but it’s bedtime here.
glad you joined us…will be over to greet you in a minute…
Welcome to the bar! Looking forward to reading yours…and sleep well.
cool prompt, Victoria!
mine is somewhat quirky, but i hope you enjoy it nevertheless… have a good day/ evening/night all!
Love quirky…Thanks for joining, Miriam.
OK – I’ve visited the first 19 – including yours, Anders ( I just couldn’t think of anything remotely intelligent to put in a comment. Sorry.) – and now it’s time to sleep. I have an early start tomorrow for a 9am hospital appointment – the follow-up to the serious illness I suffered just after Easter. Night all!
hope that goes well man….do drop by and let us know tomorrow…will keep you in my thoughts…
Home safe and well. All as it should be, so thats good. Thanks…
Good luck with the appointment, Tony. And thanks for visiting.
alright poets…dinner time here….be back in a bit to catch up…
on run Victoria = my iPad not working – all a bit hectic including poem. Wonderful post. Thanks much. k.
Thank YOU, Karin.
What an interesting article….it took me some time to find my second voice, please let me know if it fits the prompt ~
And I am all for constructive critique. Happy day to everyone ~
Beautifully done and definitely fits, Grace.
great piece grace…love that inspiration…she has a great story unfolding…smiles.
Not borne of experience, my piece demanded my writer’s attention.
hey kim…smiles.
just getting back from dinner…oy i am hurting….mexican….was so good….Ts christmas present from work….
I like to remind folks that much of my poetry is fictional, too. Although today’s isn’t.
I had a bit of trouble wrapping my brain around the different “persons” and just how they are accomplished…but I hope my submission is appropriate. Love your new photo, Victoria…very sweet. I forgot to request a critique but if anyone would like to…feel free…thanks!
Gayle ~
i feel you…the other voices are just natural to me…this one just felt different trying to write with…but that is not bad at all…smiles.
Thanks, Gayle. Person probably isn’t as important in poetry as in fiction, but it’s fun to play with and have available. The best way to wrap your brain around it, as you put it, is to read other’s. Have fun–I’m off to read yours now.
Oooh! I love it when the prompt coincides with an idea already bouncing around in my head.
Me too!
Excellent prompt Victoria – took a while to work out what I wanted to do. It is now 02.07 here – so I shall read a few excellent poems – go to bed – and read the rest later today.
Whoa, Anna. Go to bed. They’ll be waiting for you in the morning.
Fun prompt Victoria — though I doubt I will have time to participate — I wonder if prompts could be given out a head of time.
Anyway, thank you for the poem selections — they were fun reads!!
ah well you have until midnite tomorrow sabio so you still have like 26 hours to go…
this one was actually announced early in the comments at saturdays poetics….
Sabio, there are often prompt-hints on Twitter if you have an account and I subscribe to Claudia’s blog. She usually posts well ahead of time and give a hint, enough to have a go at it.
Ah, the Twitter idea is good. I may try that. I use to twit but got a bit tired of it for many reasons. Maybe I will try again. But if folks are hinting — why not hint in a formal way right on the blog — just a thought. That way more than just the groupies will see it. 🙂
well the long and short of it is, everyone that tends pub here is a volunteer, we dont get paid for what we do, though i would love to pay the pub tenders as they do a great job and so we have life outside of here…so you do what you can and know there are some things that you cant in an ideal world…
claudia and myself and usually whoever is posting are up early, claudia usually first due to time zone…and as she said we try to drop it out on twitter as well, thanks to the lovely Natasha who does most of the tweeting as well…so it usually expands our 33 hour window of posting by about 7 hours or so…
its not that we are resistant to change, but i think if you managed a prompt site you would realize a lot of work goes into it on the front and back…and in the end you will not please everyone…and if you try, you will just wear yourself out.
gottcha, thanx
Scrolling up and down in such long-list comments which are by hierarchy and finding hints would be very time consuming. And You have the option to follow comments by e-mail turned off.
This prompt made me realize I often make a point not to write in second person, but try to make poems seem more immediate and personal by writing the first person. So I did not address one of the more challenging topics but just wrote a poem that was clearly directed at someone. Perhaps I will go add another one too.
yay great to see you peggy….smiles…
Glad it didn’t deter you, Peggy.
another excellent prompt, and I am again derelict in my reading which shall have to happen tomorrow. Once again the end of day comes too soon, and morning is approaching fast…I do miss all of the wonderful poetry posted here. hopefully life shall allow more involvement again soon.
I’m almost always late because I live on the West Coast. Life right now is a challenge to many of us.
…thank you Victoria for a wonderful topic and discussion for today at the pub… a poem in ‘second person’ for me is more challenging than the one written in ‘first person’ but both are a fun to do… it gives me a more reflective mode and more personal touch with my crafts… and i really, really like the poem by Robert Herrick… thank you for sharing… for today, i’m offering a poem about the clouds this morning while heading to work… very inviting and refreshing….
smiles…
As I mentioned in comments, your poem is so Wordsworth-ian, Kelvin. Glad you met the challenge and I like your point about being more reflective.
I wanna play, I wrote a stream of garbage, but I want to read as many of your 2nd person poems as I can before I try to do the sleeping thing again. Passing out is soo much easier, just kidding. Anyway, I do not think I have written many second person poems, save the ones to myself ;), but crazy doesn’t always play well. SO I tried to write in the vacinity of sane, but I did change the name of the location to protect the innocent 🙂 Can I still get a drink in case this laying down and just going to sleep thing doesn’t work?
Ah, it’s not Wyoming? Well it could be Nevada…we have lots of bookstores (at least in the north).
BTW, I’ll leave the pitcher on the bar, Henry…hate to admit, but I’m winding down now or won’t sleep myself. Back in the morning.
smiles…sleep well victoria…great job tonight…great responses as well…about to head that way myself….have a great evening/day poets….be back in the morning to catch those as i sleep…smiles.
Oh, to be young again and survive on….how many hours of sleep?
Second person is pretty fun. Thanks for hosting Victoria. The continuation of points of view this week worked out great. I think I’ll have to write a third person piece to round things out 🙂
Sounds like a good idea to me!!!
Hey Victoria:
I have two fun ideas for 2nd person poems — but my muses need time to drink from their well. But I have some time to read so again I thank you for the intro to Robert Herrick. He is a colorful chap — I am enjoying him. Found lots of his works over at The Project Gutenberg EBook (see his poems here). Below is another of his 2nd person poems I thought you’d enjoy if you haven’t seen it. I also love his large number of Epigrams — what a fun quick way to get a feel for someone. As I showed in my “Poetry is …” image, “Epigrams” is a form of poetry. And if someone takes their proclaimed definition of Poetry and then compare it to Herrick’s epigrams, they will either have to declare that Epigrams aren’t poetry or realize that their poetry prescription is a failure.
I will keep reading and thinking about this fellow until his thoughts, times and circumstances change me a bit — cultural immersion (my favorite diving trip). Thank you.
Here is his poem:
AN HYMN TO THE MUSES (source)
Honour to you who sit
Near to the well of wit,
And drink your fill of it!
Glory and worship be
To you, sweet Maids, thrice three,
Who still inspire me;
And teach me how to sing
Unto the lyric string,
My measures ravishing!
Then, while I sing your praise,
My priest-hood crown with bays
Green to the end of days!
Thanks, Sabio. I’ve read a bit of his work (not this one) but it sounds like it would be fun to read more about him, too.
Later into the frame than ever today! Great prompt. Thanks.
the closure on yours was a hoot dave…
But so glad you’re here. No such thing as late as long as the link is still up!
What a great prompt Victoria… I’m linking one I wrote a few months ago but haven’t linked before. It was interesting to see how few of mine are usually written in the 2nd person. Look forward to reading some good stuff out there tonight..
I’m not entirely sure if the poem I posted is as per the guidelines for this particular post or not, and I do hope that I’m not breaking some unspoken norm here by posting something that I’m not entirely sure follows the prompt exactly or not. It’s an old poem, something I had written around the beginning of this year.
Cheers,
Joy…
You posted a wonderful poem, Arnab…right on! Hope to see more of you.
good morning poets….at work now, so will see you around lunch….arnab, i cant read typepad at work so i will catch you this evening….have a great day poets….write on….
Thanks, Becky. So glad you were inspired to link your poem. It touched me deeply.
Brian, hope your day goes smoothly. I’ll be out and about today as well and will finish up when I get home. Wait till you read Arnab’s!
Just a note: “If On a Winter’s Night a Traveler” by Italo Calvino is a good second-person novel. 🙂
That’s right! Thanks, Joseph. I’ve learned about this in a lit course from The Teaching Company.
hey…just coming back from the company christmas party and it’s already late over here, will brush the glitter out of my hair now and go to bed…thanks to those that stopped by my place already…. will catch up with you tomorrow morning.. smiles… have a lovely evening everyone…
Nearly missed this! And as it is , I am posting the poem I just wrote for IMWRT because it is addressing YOU, or us, and because I spent so much time on it that I wanted critique! I read your essay and enjoyed it, Victoria, and then went back to read about the critiques as they used to be. I am sorry I missed those days, though I am pretty sure I would not have been ready for them then.
Glad you made it, Susan
This was challenging. Thanks for the opportunity to try something new.
Everyone Has the Answer
You’re welcome!
great to see you at the pub friend…smiles
Hello. I maybe cheating here by linking a poem that was prompted more by the recent events – although this prompt was in my head for a couple of days now. Thank you for telling me that this poem did not strictly follow the form – that way I learned and may do better next time. 🙂 Have a great day.
Oops, I commented first before I linked and found out too late that the linky had been closed. Sorry. 🙂
There’s always Tuesday!
Yeah! I look forward to Tuesdays. 🙂
A day late hope you catch it got a virus and a load of meds so bit different so put it out as is let me know what you think http://velvetmedia.wordpress.com/2012/12/15/as-the-infinite-monkey/
Feel better soon!
Thanks Victoria enjoy the rest of your weekend